Completed Report against Glyph

Discussion in 'TTT Staff/Player Reports' started by Hongo, Apr 29, 2019.

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  1. Hongo

    Hongo VIP

    Here is some input from someone else who was on the server at the time of these events.

    [​IMG]

    If the comments are not directed at anyone, it is literally not hate speech. It can't be, as it is not being used in a hateful or derogatory manner; they were simply making statements, or talking to each other regarding their opinions of a matter. Does it belong in the server? Probably not, they should take that kind of discussion to forums, but it is not bannable.
     
  2. audrey

    audrey batty VIP

    Sorry, but "trans people are delusional and don't exist" is hatespeech. That's just a fact. Not going to argue about this further.
     
  3. when did I say "trans people are delusional and don't exist"? stop making up evidence
     
  4. Hongo

    Hongo VIP

    I didn't see that in any of the screenshots though just saying.
     
  5. audrey

    audrey batty VIP

    You're lucky that I don't have a screenshot of you saying shit like "imagine thinking you can go against nature" and etc. You said it, and that is the main thing I warned you for.
     
  6. ryan

    ryan yeet VIP

    Hello due to this getting out of hand I’ll be locking this report. If you wish to add anything in meantime ask me or another staff member for it to be unlocked.
     
  7. Pacifist

    Pacifist Cynically Insane VIP Bronze

    While I remember being on the server with you and kythol, I've got no clue what you are talking about. Not to say you are incorrect, those screenshots stand for themselves, but I've got no leg in this race.
     
  8. Kythol

    Kythol ok Moderator VIP

    I can confirm that I did at one point kick Tommy Robinson (known on the server as asffas at the time) for being toxic towards other players. When I first joined the server, I was told that he was already warned for slurs/harassment, so when I saw it I immediately kicked him. I can't speak for the ban that occurred afterwards, since I was busy dealing with a ban appeal on my own end.

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Lordyhgm

    Lordyhgm Spiteful smells Lead Admin VIP

    Aight, seeing as the reported staff-member was demoted from their position for reasons unrelated to this report, this’ll be more of a post-mortem of the events in question.

    To start:

    Staff can be harassed.

    Staff are human, they are perfectly capable of feeling harassed and offended by comments towards them or a group they identify as.
    With a regular player, if they feel harassed it can be handled as such by staff even if some disagree, the same case can apply to a staff member with sufficient evidence to show. it.
    We expect staff to have a stiff upper lip and be able to ignore petty insults and remarks as part of taking the position as the moderator to handle these issues, however, this does not mean that they will not take action when needed.

    That being said, the screenshots provided don’t show outright hate speech; some of the comments are offensive but could come from a traditionalist stance that gender is wholly physical and as part of a larger, civil conversation this would be acceptable. Glyph overstepped the mark to consider the evidence provided hate speech.


    There is also another point to brought up, staff can, and have done so often in the past, request a change in conversation/topic. This was done a lot with subjects such as cannabis and drug use before its legalisation in the majority of the US. Tommy was asked repeatedly by Glyph to cease the conversation and they persisted. If they felt Glyph had handled the situation incorrectly they should have told a teacher come to me, or made a report, with the evidence to show an over-reach in responsibility.

    Harassment Protocol

    It is not part of protocol to mute/gag as part of handling harassment and slurs, it’s usually done as part of preventing further slurs/Mic Spam while a warning is PMed and showing to a server at large that action has been taken against the offending player. As has been noted Kythol was the one to kick the player as with procedure before a ban.

    Glyph provided enough evidence to show two cases of Tommy harassing/using slurs
    https://i.imgur.com/EGq5Wdi.png
    https://i.imgur.com/CKj3GIy.png
    This would warrant the kick that was issued but without sufficient evidence of the third instance of slurs or hate speech the appeal should have been accepted.

    Loopholing:

    Due to the difficulty in determining intent, we require cases of suspected loopholing to be taken to admins to handle. This, however, does not apply to harassment as mods have discretion to ban given they can determine best the intention of spoken word and conversation. - revision as of https://www.seriousgmod.com/threads...-uglubathr-kaetilbiornsson.51902/#post-547053


    Other Points to make based on off-hand remarks made as part of the appeal/report:

    • Staff are required to let other staff handle reports/incidents involving them when online together.
    • We endeavour to not censor any conversation when not required to do so.
    • Glyph’s behaviour in handling the report was itself unacceptable, we do not allow staff to accuse players of offences without sufficient evidence and certainly do not allow any insults against members for any reason.
    • While evidence from a third party is perfectly valid to use as part of an appeal, action would have been taken afterwards to ensure the moderator was collecting their own evidence for bans.


    As it stands, Tommy was unbanned, and the ban voided due to a lack of evidence before I began writing this.

    Report: Valid

    P.S. If you feel I need to address or correct something or have something to add, please contact me on forum or discord and I will read it when I wake up.
     
  10. Grumble

    Grumble VIP

    As I was @'d in this report I just want to say my statistics aren't bigoted or racist. To assume so is borderline thought policing.
     
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