Answered Is This Ghosting?

This is something that seems to happen quite often that really bugs me.

I'm a Traitor and it's 5-on-1 against the last innocent. One of my Traitor buddies decides to admit to the last innocent that everyone still alive is a Traitor. According to the rules:

• Using third party chat to inform player of in-game events they are not yet aware of.
• This includes using in-game private chat, admin chat, steam chat, Skype, TeamSpeak, etc.
• This includes giving away information about yourself.

Not only is it giving away that they're a traitor to the last innocent, the biggest issue I have is letting the last innocent know that I'm a Traitor as well. It's a huge annoyance because then it allows the innocent to know to camp and shoot anyone he sees and this has lost the Traitors the round or gotten me killed on several occasions. This doesn't seem any different to me than someone getting Traitor and immediately announcing to the server who all the Traitors are. What really bothers me is that not only has this happened with staff online, I've even staff do it themselves.

So my question is: is it against the rules to announce to the server who your traitor buddies are?

 

If the traitor doesn't get everyone's permission then it is not considered ghosting but RDM. If you die because the innocent was informed by a traitor buddy he will be punished for RDM, not for ghosting.

 

Exactly what my fellow retired staff Zigles said. Well put, @Zigles.

 

No, this is Patrick. srsly though, they're right

 

Actually I believe we ruled that it isn't even RDM if he calls out as the last innocent.

However, a good way to save yourself is to say "That's not true, I'm innocent", the player called out as the last innocent can kill everyone but you unless you commit a traitorous act.

Do note that while calling out as the last innocent is not RDM, it's still RDM (not ghosting) to KOS a fellow T buddy.

 

Not ghosting, but a Rdm act, read motd for more info.

 

Relying information to a player that he isn't aware of is ghosting.
Like someone in spec telling a live player he's the last inno or the last traitor basically calling out all his traitorous buddies by saying "You're the last inno."
So merely mentioning he's the last innocent can be seen as ghosting (or unless you get the other traitor's consent of course.)

To me at least anyway.

 

The thing that differs between the spectator telling them and a living traitor is the fact that the person in spectator is using a different means of communication outside the global, living, chat realm. Unlike the traitor, that is using global chat to inform them.


And @Event Horizon, I'm not sure how it couldn't be considered RDM, because that person is essentially putting a KOS on everyone but the last innocent. It would be the same as if I were a traitor and said "Event Horizon is my t buddy and we are going to fuck shit up" right at the start of the round. The only thing I remember deeming different from it is if the traitor buddies agreed to calling themselves out as the traitors.

 

We made a ruling between staff awhile ago and we had to decide to either fully allow a traitor to call out the last innocent or not allow it at all. We decided to allow it.

 

So this is not RDM and ghosting?
Or is it still "considered" ghosting?

 

Simplifying rulings on those odd or rarer situations is good, and I agree with Event's stance on calling out the last innocent to not be treated as RDM. In situations where an innocent is out numbered 5 to 1 and a traitor buddy decides to inform the last innocent that everyone besides the remaining innocent are traitors, then I see no issue with that. If anything it makes the next few moments more fun to watch, and more fair for the outnumbered innocent player. We're just making things more complicated than they have to be by requiring traitors to get permission from all other traitors before saying "so and so is the last innocent".

 

Okay. It's not RDM or ghosting. Call out your t buddies when there's one innocent left as much as your little heart desires.

 

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=310266268
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=310266429

I really want to add this. In these two screenshots, BJBenny had threatened to call out his last two T Buddies if they didn't do anything, and indeed he did. And he was slain for it, unless the mod, I don't know who the mod was that slaid him. If the mod was unjust, than it is clearly RDM on the person who calls out his t buddies, in this case BJBenny.

RDM is when yourself kill/damage someone, or through a different means you do that end up getting an Inno damaged or killed.

 

Then why not just make it so that you don't call out if someone is the last innocent.

 

Let me explain why this is RDM on BOTH the traitor calling his buddies out, and the last Innocent. A traitor, while killing everyone without being caught, is a person of deception, trying to get others to believe him, and gain their trust while backstabbing them in the end. The traitors will call out false koses, get rid of evidence, etc. So normally if you were an inno and someone tells you that you're the last inno, your first thoughts might be to not trust him. But if you are the person to kill everyone without valid reason OTHER than 'You're the last Innocent' or 'We're all traitors', it'd still be killing on suspicion, and the traitor who said he was the last Inno, or calling out that everyone else are traitors, he'd be getting his t buddies killed thanks to a call by HIM.


Like a said, RDMing someone is not necessarily JUST damaging/killing an Inno/D/Traitor'without reason'...Let me tell you one way you could RDM.


It was back a few months ago on Datmap, a lot of people will just troll and get stuck under the T door in the main area of the map. I pushed someone, and it was a mod/admin, with my crowbar into the T room, now he/she can be killed cause they're in the T room and it falls under 'Traitoruous Acts'. He/She was killed and I was slain the next round, and it was because I indirectly got someone killed without actually calling somebody out or killing/damaging someone. I still RDMed someone.


I'm all for agreeing that all this isn't 'Ghosting', I don't know about it being a form of Meta-Gaming, but that's not what this is about. I firmly believe that informing the last Innocent of a round that 'He/She is the last Inno' or 'We're all Traitors' is a form of RDM. You're not damaging/killing someone, but indirectly calling out your t buddies.

 

It doesn't have to be complicated. Just say you cannot do that.

It seems bizarre to me that the number of players left makes a difference. Surely if a traitor decided to announce to the server who all of his T buddies were at the beginning of the round, he would be punished for that. How could you then allow it just because the odds are now in the Traitors favor? It also leaves the grey area of someone thinking (see: they didn't buy radar/a decoy was in the mix) that there's only one innocent left and being wrong when they announce who all their T buddies are. Then what would happen?

To me it seems easier to say that you can't call out the last innocent/announce you're all traitors than to say that you can.

 

calling out your t buddies individually is a little different than calling out the last innocent.

We definitely don't want to disallow traitors calling out the last innocent. It's one of those iconic things about TTT, but we have to design a rule that can't be loopholed easily. For example I don't want someone to be able to call out "X is the last inno" 20 seconds into the round and then, because of our rule, allow that player to kill everyone he sees.

I'm going to have a discussion with staff about this and see if we can come up with a concrete rule about this.

 

I understand about calling out individually, it doesn't put the WHOLE T team at risk, but you will responsible if those you called out is killed.

I honestly think we shouldn't allow people, as Ts, to call out the last innocent even with the consent of the team. I believe it'll cause a whole mess of confusion and chaos, when some who agrees to the call out brings up 'Okay, I died' or 'Okay, we failed, will the Inno/T who called out be slain?". Even moreso with newer players if the first thing that comes to mind is 'Wait, Ts can call out other Ts? or "Since when do Traitors tell someone they're the last person?". It completely throws out the concept of 'kill the Innocents without being caught'. If someone is foolish enough to call out the last inno early into a round, for every person that is killed as result, it'll count as one slay, three slays, then a Mass RDM ban.

But its all MY honest opinion, if this should be allowed, it should at least be run now through Staff, but through a poll for EVERYONE in the community for their opinion, such a major rule should take at least 3 months into concideration. I would be really uncomfortable stumbling upon a TTT server, play on it for a good few days, or weeks, then get a T round and towards the end have someone say "X, your the last innocent".

Like I said, this shouldn't be in the hand of Highwon, or just the staff, no offense, but in the community as this is NOT a skin/jihadsound/map suggestion

 

So given that calling last inno is essentially calling a KOS on your T buddies (for the last inno, at least) can i kill the T buddy who calls last inno, and basically KOS's me?

 

In order to give the last inno the impression that he's the last inno WITHOUT ratting out my T buddies, I usually do

Me: "Hey <insert last inno's name here>? You there?"

Last inno: "Yeah."

Me: "I have a bit of bad news for you. Do you know what it is?"