Random Robo comment of the month: Alert: I dislike Trump and won't have my opinion be swayed and so I offer a viewpoint with historic precedent. I also will likely not respond to this thread anymore so don't expect a rebuttal to anything you say to this. The only way a wall is functional or has been functional throughout modern human history is to shoot anyone who attempts to bypass it. If you're not knowing what I am referring I'm talking about the Berlin Wall which was ~100 miles long, but divided Germany for ~30 miles. This wall stopped functioning due to political rioting in order to create unity instead of divide which is a compromise to end the use of the wall rather than negate its function by breaking it down or bypassing and ignoring it. If we assume we won't gun down or catch everyone who tries to pass the wall, the precedent becomes all of the Ancient World's walls and what happened with them. They were largely unsuccessful. Easy bypassing by taking different travel routes on land or sea. Trump wants billions for 500+ miles of territory along a 2000 mile border. Compare that to any walls in the history of humanity and you match the Great Wall of China which still failed and his wall won't be nearly as big, but if the goal of his is to cover the border it will need to be as big which won't happen. You can't tell me this is a good use of money. Just seeing what I see of Trump it's his way to have a standing legacy besides his towers or casinos imprinted on America since he's all about branding and leaving a mark. That wall will be easily bypassed and it'll be several billion dollars ill-spent to fix a non-issue.
A. An illegal immigrant is committing a crime by simply being present in the United States, so, ICE is literally just enforcing the law. (They're not doing a great job of it, but it's not like people have just made up an SS Deathsquad to round up the Mexicans to put them into damp dark cells. No, they're just holding them until they can be deported, like anyone else is held for 24 hours before being released or put in jail or what have you) B. So if a group of "non savory folk" decide to start wearing Adidas, does that make Adidas brand a hate symbol? C. Yes. Communism is particularly popular among college-age Americans who don't understand how it works, which is particularly dangerous. For more information, look into the term "Useful Idiot" D. This is why I like Trump; he is throwing punches at both parties. If anything, he is the most moderate president we've had in decades. And finally, AOC is an insane socialist bartender who, by some miracle of Earth flying through a nebula of stupidity, has managed to gain a foothold in the political theater. Trump did not agree to go to the Paris Climate Accords which, is anyone surprised by this, resulted in mass protests in France when the carbon tax was jacked up so that people who drove non-electrical cars (They could not afford to buy one) were being taxed for their carbon emissions.
This is completely right, the bigger issue is stuff like 21 savage, people over staying their Visas and then not renewing or leaving. There was a pretty educational adam ruins everything episode that puts this all in a simpler way to understand it. It isn't everything there is to know about it, but its basic enough.
There is a lot to this thread that is quite intriguing, I don't think I will have time to read and respond to all that I would like to. But, checking in on it again now, I will respond to this tidbit: You're missing the point. A wall doesn't have to be 100% effective at stopping every single person who attempts to cross a border to make sense. No border wall keeps out 100%, but the fact is that countries that build walls in order to keep others out usually see at least a 90% reduction in illegal crossings. This would be a hell of a lot better than what we are seeing now. The Great Wall of China wasn't 100% effective, but it kept China for the most part safe from being overrun by the Mongols for centuries. They didn't build 13,000 miles of wall because it wouldn't work. Before the construction of the Berlin wall, 220,000 east Germans defected to the west, over a period of 16 years. For the 28 years following the wall's construction, 185 persons made it to the west. Before Israel built their border wall in 2010, they were experiencing between 5,000 and 15,000 illegal border crossings a year. When their wall became a working system, those numbers dropped below 100. In 2015, Hungary put up a border "fence" against Serbia, to keep out the Muslim hordes invading their country. Before the fence was built, Hungarian border police were apprehending upwards of 10,000 illegals every 2 days. Following the closure of the fence, the number of apprehensions dropped to essentially zero. Here is a graph that shows the relationship between the number of miles of barrier on the US/Mexican border and illegal crossings. Pretty clear picture. Spoiler: Graph Yes, you are right; in order for border walls to be effective, they must be manned, defended. And we would do so. Shooting a few illegal crossers also would be a very effective way of deterring other individuals from attempting to follow suit. The Communists trying to prevent east Germans from escaping to the west used mines and machine guns. Now, whether or not we will follow suit, remains to be seen, but the sovereign nation of the United States of America would be well within its rights to use deadly force to keep illegal immigrants, which is a friendly way to say "invaders", off its wall. It isn't the root cause of the problem, but the insanity here is that we have people who are US citizens who care more about 3rd world opportunists and criminals than their own countrymen. Enough law and order still prevails for them to get away with having their heads so deep in the sand, but, if we continue down this road of self-destruction, that will quickly cease to be the case. And the $5 billion President Trump wants for border security pales utterly in the face of the billions squandered on foreign aid for which the American people receive no benefit, only lost money, and the billions that is given in welfare to degenerates and those who illegally cross our borders. They are at least well fed and have a roof over their heads while awaiting deportation or release within our country, all on the working American taxpayer dime; not all good American citizens can say they have the same.
And I say this to make a point, not to be directly demeaning, but allowing those into the military who suffer from the confusion they call "trans-gender identity" is retarded for the reason that they are combat ineffective at worst, and an unnecessary drain on resources at best. The amount of money the military spends on fancy weaponry is not relevant; they certainly should be more careful with their taxpayer funding. But, to pay to cater to people who have their heads so far up their ass that they can't look down below their pant line and see what they are, doesn't even align with the purpose of the military, which is to defend the USA and its citizenry. And combat ineffective is a huge problem. A woman can't even serve effectively in a combat role, which isn't saying they are somehow less than a man, just that they are not biologically capable of that task. How much more ineffective is a woman who thinks she's a man, or a man who is pumped up on hormones and surgically altering his body? When a hostile force threatens your home, who are you going to want to keep you, your family, and your home safe: the biological male, who has a centuries old track record of being a proven, capable, and willing warrior, or the alternative as detailed above? Your answer when your life depends on it will be much different than what you might spout now, guaranteed.
Yes, illegal border crossings would slow, but overstayed visas have out paced illegal border crossing for 7 years already, and account for over half of all illegal immigrants. So you are wanting to fix the hyped up bit, not the bigger issue.
Just saying - that guy makes some pretty bad videos. They're usually full of misinformation, I might even call them lies. He's like the left wing version of Crowder - he just parrots things you want to hear. I dislike illegal immigrants too, but shooting those who try to cross isn't the solution. The only time it's alright to shoot someone is when you or someone else is in immediate danger - and those illegal immigrants aren't really putting anybody in an immediate danger. Do you really think a border patrol agent is going to shoot a mother with a kid on her back? We're not talking about murderers and rapists here -- we're talking about human beings looking to get away from the cartel's reach. They should do it legally, just like my family did in the '50s, instead of breaking the law.
Like I said, he doesnt say everything, just like getting view points from right wing people wont say everything. Also, by educational I mean that he will push you to do some research by yourself, there are plenty showing that the wall is the wrong answer for illegal immigration, and that instead we need to focus on over stayed visas. Here looking for some actual reports to prove my point here you are
There is outside information which makes this graph not very usable. To many illegal immigrants, the United States has become less desirable for many reasons. Therefore, this graph means nothing. Spoiler: unrelated graph example This is what it looks like to me. There are other reasons for the reduced illegal immigrants.
True, so increased deportations and increased documentation to prevent this from happening is also in order. However, illegal border crossings leads to more immigrants claiming "asylum" and being released into the USA, compounding the problem. Neither point cancels the other, and stopping the flow of illegal individuals I would say is more important. Once we know the numbers we're dealing with inside, we can handle things better; with more flowing in, we're still trying to do damage control. What I said is that a sovereign nation would be within its rights to use deadly force to keep someone from illegally entering, no matter what the circumstance. And deadly force would also send a clear and unmistakable message, "We are not welcome this way, we may die if we try, so we'll stay out." Very little of this force would have to be employed and no one would try to climb the wall anymore. The problem we have now is illegals entering and than just surrendering, because they know that, instead of having their asses kicked right back over the border like they should be, they will be taken in, given food and shelter, and might even get before a judge who will buy their sob story and let them stay. And if nothing else they may spend years in limbo in the legal system, feeding off your and my taxes. Until every native born, legal, hardworking American citizen mother and child have nothing to fear, have all their needs met without fail, never have to worry about crime or their next meal, let alone being crowded out by unproductive free loaders who don't even speak their language, we shouldn't give a rats ass about anyone coming from another nation, or what befalls them. We owe our first duty to our own people, not someone else. People gush about the "Dreamers"; our own citizens have dreams, too. People wail about the invaders who die crossing the desert, and turn a blind eye when those same invaders murder one of our own, one of our women and mothers, one of our public servants, who put their life on the line for us. People want to give handouts at their and their countrymen's expense to these loafers, when some of their own hardworking brethren go to bed hungry at night. People decry the temporary separating of criminal border crossers from their children so they can be legally processed, yet they won't use the same energy to stop their neighbors sons and daughters from being exploited, trafficked, abused. America didn't become the envy of the world because we ran to another country when we had problems. We stood and fought, we righted the wrong, even at the price of the ultimate sacrifice. That is what all these people who you say are "escaping the cartel" should do as well. If we let all those unwilling to mend their own broken nations enter ours, guess what will happen to our country? It will soon become indistinguishable from theirs. And the greatest outrage is those who come here and demand privileges, and then denigrate and demand the servitude, the ousting of those who gave them the only opportunity they ever had. They are so blind they will kill the hand that feeds them, to their own great loss. When I said that, I did not mean that it was the single only factor in reducing the illegal crossings; in the past three years, a multitude of things have done so. But, this one is by far head and shoulders above the rest. Along sections of the border that do have physical barriers, communities have peace, they don't have these criminals running through their backyards. All the other examples I gave should have shown you that. You are cherrypicking, looking at this in an irrelevant abstract. Your statement means nothing.
Doc what man can shoot someone with a kid on their back, then go home and sleep at night? If the border patrol took things that seriously, nobody would work for them. What you're proposing is taking away a human beings fundamental right to live without due process of law. I understand taking out some gang-bangers who are trying to kill the border patrol guys or whatever, but killing a damn near innocent person who wants a better life for their child? That's a bit extreme. Deport -- yes. Murder -- no.
The government shut down literally showed that closing down most aspects of big gov literally had no impact on most people. The people really impacted were gov workers, and the stupid coast guard. LuL
I dont understand where you got those numbers from, or if they're even true, but the fact is that Trump's approval rating at this point in the presidency is the second lowest in the last 5 presidents, the lowest being Reagan with 35%. Ignoring Reagan, his approval rating is the lowest in the last 10+ presidents
A. The problem is it's not 24 hours. Its weeks, possibly even months before they're processed and transported. Not to mention the subhuman conditions and separation from their children. B. This statement is hypocritical, given your previous points. You believe all dems are SJWs or commies because a few spout some idiotic bullshit, that's not a representation of all dems, but you choose to believe it is. I dont believe all people wearing MAGA hats are racist, but if I used your own logic, I would C. Not entirely sure why you continue to bring up communism. Asking for taxes to go toward healthcare and tuition isn't communism. Its giving a life to the less fortunate. I think college-age Americans know what communism means, but I don't think you do D. He throws punches at anyone who disagrees with him on anything. That's not a bipartisan issue, and it certainly doesn't help with approval. One moment hes applauding Fox News for being on his side, but as soon as anyone from the show criticizes him, he burns that bridge. Edit: Not to mention that communists and Democrats are completely different parties. By definition, one cannot be the other.
I've heard foreign aid thrown about a bit as a waste of money or large expenditure that may be better spent elsewhere, so I just thought I'd add that there are almost no situations in which the donating country and it's citizens don't benefit. It may be disproportionate, but it's aid, not a trade deal.
